752: F1, the Xbox Mobile app and ElGato

Larry Hryb: Welcome to the Xbox Podcast. My name is Larry Hryb, Xbox Live's Major Nelson. We're all here together. We're ready to go. Kind of moved my camera a little bit of an angle here to give you guys a different... to allow the real talent to come in here. Jeff, Rebecca, hello.

Jeff Rubenstein: He said a nice thing about us. I don't even know how to adapt to that, because I had like six or seven things.

Rebecca Gordius: I know. That's so sweet.

Larry Hryb: Well, it's great-

Jeff Rubenstein: I was really going to go after you.

Larry Hryb: It's great to see you guys. We were off last week because of the holidays and work schedules, but we're back this week. Rebecca, you're still out in New York, right? You're still over there in the city?

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. I watched the fireworks from Brooklyn, which was pretty exciting.

Larry Hryb: That's good for you. The Fourth of July/Independence Day fireworks. Did we have fireworks here, Jeff? I don't remember.

Jeff Rubenstein: No. We were in such a drought that they were just like, "No. We're not lighting things on fire." But I saw your pictures, and I was pretty jealous.

Rebecca Gordius: More country bumpkin Fourth for me.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, that's the big style. I'll tell you, we've got a few things to talk about this week. We've got some news we'll talk about later on. We've got what we're playing. I've got not one, not two, three interviews. Rebecca, are you a racing fan?

Rebecca Gordius: Not really. I like driving fast, but I don't know about watching someone else drive fast.

Larry Hryb: In some places-

Jeff Rubenstein: It all starts from there.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, exactly. In some places, that's called racing. Jeff's going to interview... We're going to talk about F1, which is very big in Europe. You're going to learn more about F1 racing, which is those little-

Jeff Rubenstein: Yeah, from Codemasters, the folks that made Dirt 5.

Larry Hryb: Cody.

Jeff Rubenstein: This year. So, we know they're very good at what they do. So, looking forward to getting into F1, which is out this week.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. And then I'm going to talk about the new Xbox app, and Jeff, we're going to give you many reasons that you should actually update your apps. We talk about that in the interview.

Jeff Rubenstein: Okay.

Rebecca Gordius: Finally.

Jeff Rubenstein: Oh, god. I'm afraid to look at what I'm at right now.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, could you show us, by the way? Oh, okay.

Jeff Rubenstein: I'm at 85.

Larry Hryb: This is giving me a seizure. And then, also we're going to wrap it up. We're going to talk to Elgato. Elgato, which supplies us with microphones and whatnot. They make all sorts of great... Yeah, you've got one there, the Wave microphone. We're going to talk about some of their new products, including their new camera, which I'm actually using right now. So, that's why-

Rebecca Gordius: Oh.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. It actually has a different view. I wanted to change things up for everybody. So, those are the interviews we've got. Rebecca, tell us, what are you playing? What have you been up to?

Rebecca Gordius: Well, not to jump ahead to news, but this week we announced the Echoing Void DLC for Minecraft Dungeons. It's not out for another couple of weeks, but I took it as my opportunity and reminder to get back into Dungeons. I also had never played Dungeons on a Switch before, but we just released cross-platform saves a couple of months ago.

Larry Hryb: So, you were testing. So, you were testing.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah, I was testing it out. So, it was really easy. First thing, I loaded up my Switch, and my character wasn't there, and I kind of panicked, but then I realized you have to actually go and push download from one platform to download your hero, and then I went back on my Switch. It was really. Downloaded my hero. And now I've been jumping back in on Switch. It's fun. A new set of controls to learn, though.

Larry Hryb: Good tip. Good tip. Yeah, it's funny, because I was reading the comments last week on the YouTube, because the video was up on YouTube, and somebody was angry that you were talking about Minecraft on PlayStation. Like, "Why are you talking about that?" And I have to remind you that, first of all, Rebecca, you work on the Minecraft team on the PR team and comms team, but Minecraft is on everything. And you are going to hear about other platforms on this Xbox podcast. I know it says Xbox Podcast, but Minecraft's a big game. Yes, Jeff.

Jeff Rubenstein: I'm afraid to talk about what I've been playing then. Because I do have Dungeons on Switch, and sometimes... It's just a really good travel game. I love it. Is there a place to go to find out the steps to bring your character from Xbox or PC over to Switch?

Rebecca Gordius: There is Minecraft.net. It's the community site. There is a ton of information. Dungeons has its own page there. But honestly, it was a lot easier than I had expected it would be. You can kind of see Pumba's little butt over here.

Jeff Rubenstein: I was about to say, [inaudible]? Go back to that full screen.

Rebecca Gordius: I know. Hi, buddy. Say hi.

Jeff Rubenstein: It's a delicious looking hotdog. Oh, Pumba is great. I just saw the hotdog.

Larry Hryb: He's just relaxing. Just leave him alone.

Rebecca Gordius: Oh.

Larry Hryb: Just leave him alone.

Jeff Rubenstein: Is that a Nathan's hotdog? You're living the full New York life.

Larry Hryb: Nathan's Famous.

Jeff Rubenstein: Joey [Chestnut] came over, and you were hanging out, and you left a hotdog.

Rebecca Gordius: This is all very over my head. I'm sorry. I haven't been in New York that long.

Larry Hryb: Live there a few more years, and you'll get it. Anyway, so I'm sorry, so I guess the takeaway here, Rebecca, is that if you're playing Dungeons on another device and you want to play it on your Switch, as you did, there's a few steps you have to do.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. Basically, if I had just taken my Switch and left home, then I would've been in trouble.

Larry Hryb: In a pickle.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. But you basically have to download whatever platform you've been playing on, download the character, or upload it to the cloud, and then that way you can download it on the new platform. So, it's relatively easy. You just have to do some planning beforehand.

Larry Hryb: All right. Well, that's good to know. What else are you playing? You're playing Dungeons on your Switch. What else are you playing?

Rebecca Gordius: That's been most of it. I had a friend in town this last weekend, and so we were out and about, painting the town red.

Larry Hryb: Oh. Okay.

Jeff Rubenstein: You've been living your life.

Rebecca Gordius: Although, it's been raining like crazy. Yeah, but it's been raising so much here, though. Maybe that's my other new New Yorker thing, is I have water damage in my apartment after this last weekend.

Larry Hryb: Well, yeah, it's interesting, because I was talking to my family on the east coast, and they're getting Seattle-style continued... It's actually even worse, just the amount of rain.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: It's just hot and steamy there, so stay dry, I guess, as best you can.

Jeff Rubenstein: You got fireworks because of it.

Rebecca Gordius: Who would've thought that I... Yeah. Yeah, fair.

Jeff Rubenstein: You brought it with you.

Rebecca Gordius: What are you guys playing?

Larry Hryb: You know what? I finally have finished the first two chapters of Sea of Thieves: A Pirate's Life. Now, 100% both of them. I'm spending a lot of time in there. I had to play I think each of them twice to really get the 100% and complete all the accommodations. So, that's what I've been focusing on. I'm going to try for my third one hopefully this weekend. But I haven't really had any... What else have I been playing? Oh, Rain on Your... I'm just looking behind me, Rain on My Parade, or Rain on Your Parade, I'm playing that. A little bit of Halo: Master Chief Collection, because they're always tweaking that and updating it, and there's a specific level in there that I've been testing it on my backbone using Game Pass streaming. So, I've been really having a good time with that.

Rebecca Gordius: Nice.

Larry Hryb: But yeah, I've been spending a lot of time outside. To Jeff's point, it's been dry here, so you have to make hay when the sun is shining, as it were.

Jeff Rubenstein: A little old farm adage from Larry. You don't just learn about the games here, you learn about planting season, and when you should make the hay.

Larry Hryb: We'll be doing crop reports on the other podcast. Jeff, what are you playing?

Jeff Rubenstein: Yeah, of course. I was talking about Scarlet Nexus on our last show a couple of weeks ago. I ended up finishing that, and that was definitely one of my favorite games this year. I got a shout out from the game director, which was really awesome. So, then I was looking around. I was watching TWOX this week on Xbox, last week, and there was a game that looked really interesting to me called Imagine Earth.

Larry Hryb: And the only reason you watched it is because you did the voiceover for it. I know this.

Jeff Rubenstein: No, no, it was when you did it. I did it two weeks ago. Obviously I watch it when I do it because I want to make sure I'm not going, "Um," too much, which I completely do. It's a habit. You've got to hear yourself do it and stamp it out. Yeah, I just did it. Imagine Earth is a really cool game. I've always enjoyed these... I think they call them the 4H... No, is that the farming thing?

Larry Hryb: 4H, we're back at farms.

Jeff Rubenstein: 4X games, where they're essentially colonization games, and there's-

Larry Hryb: Right.

Jeff Rubenstein: Civilization is the perfect example of that. And there was definitely some vibes there, where you go to these new planets, and they're relatively small, and you build civilizations on there, and you trade with the aliens and stuff like that. It looked really interesting because you see the whole planet, and it's very small.

Larry Hryb: What do aliens need?

Jeff Rubenstein: What do aliens need? Gold, mostly. There's really not that much [crosstalk].

Larry Hryb: Because they're going to make weapons to extinguish the human race, so be careful there.

Jeff Rubenstein: I didn't get that far into the game.

Larry Hryb: Okay.

Jeff Rubenstein: So, I thought that was a really interesting game.

Larry Hryb: I don't know.

Jeff Rubenstein: Then I played Space Jam: A New Legacy, the game, which is available for free.

Rebecca Gordius: How was it?

Jeff Rubenstein: Just across our platform. Originally, I think on July 1st, it was available as a perk for Xbox Game... but now anyone can get it, whether they're on Game Pass or not. Old school, beat him up, if you've ever played Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, the arcade game, or Streets of Rage, or Double Dragon, it's very much like that except you're using Lebron. It's a relatively short game. I think I beat it in 35 minutes, but a fun little romp through, and some nice... Oh. I'm an uncle now, and I think that happened today.

Larry Hryb: Oh, congratulations. Do you need to take that call?

Jeff Rubenstein: Should I keep doing the show or do I see my niece for the first time?

Larry Hryb: You need to go do that. We'll take care of it from here. We're going to disconnect you.

Jeff Rubenstein: Okay, I'm going to let you do that.

Larry Hryb: Good luck. Congratulations.

Jeff Rubenstein: Oh my god. Hey. I'll see you guys.

Larry Hryb: Bye. I'll just do that. When you're over here, that's the way it works, so I'm going to have to... Let me see if I can bring us in here. Anyway, Rebecca, it's going to be you and I, I guess, for the rest of the show, which is fine, because, well, you know how it is. We're going to have to do what we can do. So, let's...

Rebecca Gordius: Yep.

Larry Hryb: How's that?

Rebecca Gordius: No worries. Jeff's off being an uncle. It's all good. Oh, I like that background. That's nice.

Larry Hryb: Something a little different. But anyway, so yeah, we heard what Jeff's playing. We heard what you're playing. Thank you for the Minecraft update. The Minecraft Dungeons update. There's so many parts of the Minecraft universe. You're so busy over there on Minecraft.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. Even for Dungeons... So, the Echoing Void is our sixth and final DLC for now, but we actually have a lot more that we have planned for Dungeons, so stay tuned. But for now, just get through the DLC while you can.

Larry Hryb: Stay tuned. Stay tuned. Stay tuned. We're going to take a break now. We'll do the interviews since Jeff... We're going to reset ourselves here. We're going to do the interviews. We'll start with Jeff. We're going to talk about F1 and all the greatness that is in the F1 series in this great new game from Codemasters.

Jeff Rubenstein: Historically, Formula 1 racing has not been nearly as popular in America as it is in Europe, South America, Asia. We've got NASCAR and Indy Car over here, and, oh, man, those F1 races start pretty early in the morning over here. But things are starting to change. Last year, Formula 1 was the fastest growing professional sport across social channels like Twitter, Facebook, Instagram. That reminds me of where soccer was in this country about 20 years ago. That's when I started watching the Premier League, and playing FIFA really helped deepen that fandom. So, if you're one of the growing number of folks here in the US setting an alarm, waking up early on weekends to watch F1, well, you're probably going to want to play the official game, F1: 2021, available now on Xbox, and joining us now is Lee Mather, the senior creative director of the F1 series at Codemasters in the UK. Thanks for joining us.

Lee Mather: Yeah, absolutely. Pleasure. Can't wait to talk about it.

Jeff Rubenstein: All right. Well, let's get right into it. Lee, let's start with F1, the sport. It's growing fast here, as I said. What do you think is the most attractive part of F1 racing? What makes it special to you?

Lee Mather: There's so many things that make Formula 1 a unique motor sport and an exciting motor sport. Obviously the technology that's involved, it's the absolute pinnacle of technology in automotive these days, but also the drivers are all very exciting characters. There's a lot of very young talent coming through. And then it's such a global sport. It's loved by people all around the world. It goes to multiple countries. So, the appeal's incredibly broad.

Jeff Rubenstein: So, you mentioned the racers and how much of a draw they are for F1 fans. Even I know Louis Hamilton. So, how do drivers like him and the other 19 top stars show up in the game?

Lee Mather: Yeah. We got to great lengths to make sure that we represent the sport very accurately. So, for the drivers, we turn up at the circuits with a full facial scanning rig. We have a bunch of guys who take a ton of photographs. So, we did a photogrammetry, but we also have a 3D scanner that we take to the circuits. So, they stand there, and the drivers sit there with what looks like an iron being moved around their face. But, it's great. It means that we can represent them very accurately.

Jeff Rubenstein: And it's a lot less painful than an iron in your face, which is I think why they probably agreed to do it.

Lee Mather: Probably.

Jeff Rubenstein: So, there's a new mode that sounded really interesting to me, as an entry point, a story mode called Breaking Point. What can you tell us about that?

Lee Mather: Yeah. Breaking Point, it's a story experience that we've created in F1: 2021. So, back in 2019, we toyed with the idea and did a short feeder series into Formula 2, and we thought we did a really good job of that, and we did a great job of bringing characters and atmosphere and excitement to it. We thought, "Let's take it to the next level. Let's do a full dramatized story in the world of Formula 1." And then obviously Netflix came along and did Drive to Survive, and the two just go together really nicely. So, as you mentioned there, Formula 1's growing in success, and people are loving it more so in America, and I think Drive to Survive has really driven that. And now what people see in the game, that would also really cement that further.

Jeff Rubenstein: Yeah, you're right. That Netflix series, I've been hearing from some of my friends... I feel like I'm just on the cusp there. So, in sports games, I usually get into the career mode, and often, that's, for me, something of a solo experience. I grind my way through the season and level up my player. But in F1, you can bring a friend along. You would expect maybe as a teammate, but as a rival. Tell me how that works.

Lee Mather: Yeah. We thought that would be a very exciting dynamic. So, as you mentioned, the single-player career is something that this game has been built around for many years now. It's been incredibly successful, and it's really loved by the fans. But, we thought, what better than to experience it with a friend? And then to flip that on its head, why not do it as a rivalry as well? So, as you mentioned, you get the choice of either racing with a friend, a team, and taking that team to becoming the Constructor's Champion, or alternatively, starting at separate teams and racing to try and become champion. And then alternatively, you might even find yourselves through the contract system actually getting a deal where you're actually signed for the same team, so it really changes the dynamic over the single-player experience.

Jeff Rubenstein: Yeah, it sounds really interesting. So, last time Codemasters was really high up on our radar here at Xbox was late last year as Dirt 5 launched, along the Xbox Series X and Series S. So, the team at the time, they pushed the hardware. Very visually strong game. I had a lot of fun with that one. And importantly, they continued to tweak and improve after launch as well, improving the graphics at the 120 frame speed. Anyway, I know you have a very technically strong team over there. What have you been able to do visually and technically with F1: 2021, now that you've had those Series X and Series S dev kits for quite a while longer?

Lee Mather: Yeah. So, something which is obviously new to the series for us, as you mentioned, with Dirt, was the 120 fps mode. So, you get the choice on Series X of running either in a graphics mode or in a performance mode. We've also got the fantastic fast load times. I still can't believe how instantly you press the button and you're there, you're at the circuit. But also visually as well, you'll see the increasing graphics fidelity, the extra floor cover, the extra particle effects, and also on the Series X and S, you'll get the advanced damage model as well. So, you'll get to see more damage for the vehicles and the impacts, the carbon splintering, but also the advanced tire model as well, advanced tire damage. So, all of those things have allowed us... the extra performance has allowed us to really showcase those areas of the game.

Jeff Rubenstein: Very cool. Very cool, Lee. Last thing. I'm thinking of jumping in. I've been watching these videos. My friends have been watching that Netflix series. So, what is the best place for me to start?

Lee Mather: Ooh, definitely, I think the thing that's going to get everybody playing first is going to be jump into Breaking Point. Breaking Point's a really great way to learn about the sport, to also get excited by the characters and behind the scenes in the world of Formula 1, and also, it's a nicely-balanced experience, so you can choose to play it from a casual perspective and make it much easier. You can make it a more challenging on-track experience, or you can obviously turn the difficulty up and make it a far more challenging experience. So, I think that's a great entry point to the series for anybody who's really new to Formula 1 and wants to see what it's all about.

Jeff Rubenstein: Sounds perfect. That's where I'm going to start, and I can start that today, as F1: 2021, the official video game, is out now on Xbox. Thanks so much, Lee.

Larry Hryb: One of the many ways that gamers stay connected is of course with their mobile device. Michael Khalilian is with me. Michael, you handle and work on the Xbox app, which a lot of people find on their mobile devices. Welcome to the show.

Michael Khalili...: Thanks, Larry. Thanks for having me on.

Larry Hryb: I've got to tell you, I'm excited to talk to you, because you guys are constantly working on the app and making it better. Tell us about some of the things that we've got in the app now and that you're working on that people are going to see very soon.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. So, as you know, we relaunched this app last year in September, really in preparation for the Xbox Series X and the Series S. And we really did that because we wanted users to have this brand new modern experience to fit in with their new devices at Xbox. If you think about some of the features that we launched with, remote play was really the big net new feature that we invested in last year, which really fits into the vision of Xbox, of being able to play anywhere you are. And so, with remote play, users can be at the mall, turn on their console remotely and directly play FIFA from the mall. So, we thought that was a really cool net new feature to launch the Xbox app with.
And then from there, we've really just listened to user feedback. We've been monitoring our socials.

Larry Hryb: And my socials.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. I know we all get pinged a lot about new features in the Xbox app, but since then, we've really been trying to listen to our users, listen to our players, and add and iterate from the launch of the Xbox app.

Larry Hryb: It's interesting, because you talked about this remote play, which you can see my console right behind me. You talked about maybe people streaming to the mall or maybe wherever they are.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: But I know people that use it just to frankly stream to their bedroom, right? If it's in the TV room, they want to stream it across to the other side of the house, and that enables them to do that, and it gives them the full access to their library and everything else there. So, that's really great. But so many people use the app now, and a lot of people may forget that you can also do your console setup through the app, right? Instead of having to type everything in with the virtual keyboard on the console, we've all got the soft keyboards on our mobile devices. It really helps the setup as well, doesn't it?

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. That was one of the big things that we invested in as well last year. So, in the unboxing of your Xbox, you can now set it up directly through the app, which is a more modern, magical experience. It's sort of what users expect when they're setting up a new app, is to be able to set it up through their mobile device.

Larry Hryb: Right.

Michael Khalili...: And, sometimes app updates and console updates take a long time when you unbox them, and so this way, you can turn it on, set it up, and go do something else.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, you're having a great dual screen experience, because while it's getting its download and its updates, you're going through and signing in, setting your options, so that the moment that this thing's ready to go, assuming you'd use the Xbox app, you're really ready to go and start playing a game.

Michael Khalili...: One of the cool features of the setup experience is pre-install. So, in the app, before your console is even done setting up, you can choose the games and the apps that you want to be on your console right when your console starts. And so, you don't have this, "My console is now updated; now I have to install FIFA," which is a much better experience.

Larry Hryb: Some of the other things we've got is, of course, we're sitting here, we're playing games on our beautiful screens in our living rooms or where have you, but a lot of people use the Xbox app, which is available on all your finer app stores, to share game clips and screen shots and the chats and achievements and notifications. There's a lot going on in here. You really have to have this app if you really want to maximize your Xbox experience, don't you?

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. When we think of the app, we think of three distinct areas that the app has value. The first one is what we just mentioned, it's discover and play. So, if you open the Xbox app right now, you'll see a Netflix-like experience with channels of game recommendations. You can see what your friends are playing. You can see what the most popular games on Xbox is. Then you can really go straight from discovering a new game to playing that game directly on the phone. So, that's really the first pillar.
The second one is all about social. And so, we know the most popular features of this app is Xbox Messaging. It's Xbox Party Chat. It's teaming up with their friends, maybe when they're not already at their console. And so, we see Xbox Messaging being used a lot for users setting up a play session. Maybe you're sitting on your couch or laying in your bed. You want to know if your friend's online. So, you can open the app, check to see if your friend's online. You see they're playing Fortnite. You send them a message, "Hey, I'm going to be on in 10."

Larry Hryb: And away you go.

Michael Khalili...: Right. And so, social, and just the social utility of being able to keep up with your friends when you're not at your console is one of the core user scenarios of the app.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, just staying connected, that's really what it's all about. And your team really brings everything together, again, into the app, so that you can have it not only when you're sitting on your couch or in your bed when you're playing your game, but wherever you are, you're staying connected, so that you can really... And I know that I've done this. I've been out in my car, and I see people playing a game. I'm like, "Oh, I want to join that party," and I've actually had party conversations on my Bluetooth headset in my car. And it's great because I can hear what they're doing and I still feel connected to the audience, and that's really exciting.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. Some users want to use their AirPods for Party Chat, and that's something the app can let you do. And just speaking to that, the interconnected piece, the third area of how we think about the app is really as a companion to your console. And so, if you open the app right now, and you can see your entire collection of games, you can see which games are installed on which consoles. If you want to install a new game, you can free up space on that console. And then, you can turn on your console remotely and actually remotely control your console from the app itself, which we know is a pretty cool feature, because things like typing on a console could be harder than typing on a keyboard.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. That's absolutely true. We talked about that a moment ago, how easy it is. Your team is looking forward. Can you give us a clue... You mentioned earlier before we got started, there's an update coming this month for the Xbox app. Tell us a little bit about that update and what you guys are planning maybe for later this year.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. So, we have our July update coming in a few weeks now. As you know, achievements was one of the really big fan requested features that we add back to the app. So, we were super happy to deliver that in the last few months. And so, now we have achievements, we have leaderboards in the app. In July, we're going to add compare and filter and sort to the achievement experience.

Larry Hryb: Awesome. Awesome.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah, you can compare your achievements with your friends, in addition to being able to look at your leaderboard to see who has the most gamer score that month. We added new filter and sort options, just to give you more options to be able to sort the achievements. We know some users have hundreds of thousands of achievements, so you can now sort it by most rare, most common, locked, unlocked, things like that. So, yeah, that'll be out in our July update in the next few weeks here. If you have the app, it should just update automatically. If you don't have the app, you can just search Xbox in any app store and find it.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, it's funny, because Jeff, who is on the show with me, he and I have this ongoing thing about he's one of those people that never updates his apps. He sits there with the big 37 apps to be updated bag in his store, and I'm like, "Dude, update it." You have to update your app. That's the way you're going to get some of these cool features that Michael's talking about. So, pro tip, update your apps.

Michael Khalili...: Just speaking to that, we launched the app eight months ago. We've done seven updates since then.

Larry Hryb: Wow.

Michael Khalili...: So, almost every single month we've had an app update, and most of those updates are direct feature requests that we see from fans on Reddit, on Twitter, through the app feedback. And so, updating the app and really getting that iterative value that we're adding is super important.

Larry Hryb: And you're not just putting bug fixes in the notes. You're actually putting real release notes in the app. You're not one of those people, are you?

Michael Khalili...: I don't think we've had one app release that was just bug fixes.

Larry Hryb: Right.

Michael Khalili...: Because it's more storage, it takes time for users to have to get that app update, and so we want to make-

Larry Hryb: To hit the update button? Come on, Michael, it's not that hard.

Michael Khalili...: We want to make sure to add at least some value every month.

Larry Hryb: Sure.

Michael Khalili...: And so, whether that's something like custom gamer picks, adding custom images back into Messaging, even the ability to have the favorite friend online notification, which was a huge fan requested feature. They want to know when their friends come online. And so, you now have the option to get a push notification when your friend starts playing Fortnite.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. That's kind of awesome, too. So, that update will be out later this month, and as you said, you've been updating pretty much every month. Can you give us a little clue what you're planning down the line? I don't want you to commit to any specific features, but what are some ideas that you guys are thinking of?

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. So, some app users might've already seen last month in June we launched what we're calling Game Stories. So, we launched that as an experiment. That means some users have the experience right now, and some users don't have the experience. And we did that because we want to test it out, get user feedback, and really fine tune it before we release it to the entire audience. So, we launched that in June. And Game Stories really is our first foray into giving users new ways to interact with content on Xbox. And so, now when you open the app, you can see those developer posts from Fortnite, from Minecraft, from FIFA, from Red Dead Redemption, and interact with that in a really mobile-friendly way. We know stories, Instagram, TikTok, these are the ways that users interact with content nowadays, and it makes sense, because they're very touch-friendly, they're mobile-focused.

Larry Hryb: Yep. And we always have our phone with us, too. Wherever we are, we always have our phone with us.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. And so, for the Xbox app, we really want to snap to existing industry patterns. We don't want to create something totally net new that's separate from what users are already using on mobile, and how they interact with content. So, it's really cool. Right now, you can tap through developer updates, you can comment on it, you can reply to other users' comments, you can like comments, you can share those posts with your friends in Xbox Messaging. And this is really the net new experience our team has been working on for the past couple of months here.
Super excited about the future. This is just step one. So, we're really invested in the stories UX. In the future, we're really looking to see how-

Larry Hryb: Hold on, Michael. You said UX. A lot of people may not know what that is. Explain UX.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. So, UX is just the user interface. So, UI is really user interface, but UX is how a user interacts with that interface.

Larry Hryb: So, it's experience, the user experience kind of thing, right?

Michael Khalili...: Right. And so, Game Stories is really just step one for us. We see, in the future, lighting up new ways for users to be able to express themselves on Xbox. So, right now, one of the big things that the app is missing is the ability to share and customize your activity. And so, that's something that we see as a huge opportunity. We see users asking us for it, "How do I share my activity with my friends? How do I know what my friends are up to on Xbox? How do I customize my activity?" So, maybe you record this really cool game clip. How do you edit that on mobile, customize it, add gifs to it, add text to it? A lot of cool stuff we're working on that we're excited to get out for our users.

Larry Hryb: I know that it's all great features. I'm testing an internal version right now, and there's some really cool stuff you guys have added in there. I can't really say too much more, but I'm really excited. Now, if you want to get all those new features, as Michael said, you've got to update your app, okay? You've got to keep going. You've got to hit that update button, right, Michael?

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. If you're on Xbox right now and you don't have the app, just open up the Apple App Store or Google Play Store, Amazon Store, and just search Xbox. Super easy to find, and we think it adds a lot of value to our players.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. I think people really enjoy that. So, Michael Khalilian, your team works on the amazing Xbox app, as you just said, available in all the finer app stores out there. Appreciate your time today. Let's get you on in the future and we'll talk more about the Xbox app maybe in a few months when you have some more features out there.

Michael Khalili...: Yeah. We have a whole team dedicated to this experience now. We're more dedicated to mobile than ever, so I expect we'll have some exciting new experiences in the future to come back and talk about.

Larry Hryb: Well, on behalf of gamers everywhere, I want to thank you and your team for really making this one of the greatest mobile experiences, a great mobile companion to the console, so thank you very much, Michael.

Michael Khalili...: Thanks, Larry.

Larry Hryb: Big week for Elgato. A lot of new products coming out. Miguel Lozada, who's the senior partnership manager over there at Elgato. Miguel, always good to talk to you. Great to see you, my friend.

Miguel Lozada: Great to see you. Long time no see. Ready to see you in person pretty soon, hopefully. Fingers crossed.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. We usually run into each other at [PAX], and you're like, "Hey, hey, come here. Show me some cool products." So, now we get to do it for fans and together. You guys had a-

Miguel Lozada: Yeah, together.

Larry Hryb: You guys had a pretty big week this week. Earlier this week you announced some new products, and I wanted to get you on to talk about that. Let's go through it.

Miguel Lozada: It's a little bit of stuff. Yeah. A few products. We're always striving to make things better for creators, for everybody. We want to give you guys production-type quality at a consumer rate, and that's our goal. We just want to help everybody create cool stuff.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, and you guys have done that. So, you've got a few products, and I'm actually using one of them right now, so we'll talk about... we're using a bunch of them right now. But let's talk about... Where do you want to start? Do you want to start with the camera, or where do you want to go here, my friend?

Miguel Lozada: Let's go camera. We'll start camera. I think that's what everybody wants to hear about, right? The camera, [crosstalk].

Larry Hryb: Which I am using right now, and you're using it as well. Let's talk about it.

Miguel Lozada: We're both using it. Yeah. So, brand new camera. We're really excited about this. It's been a few years in the making. 1080, 60 frames a second, no mic, because really, who's using a mic on their webcam at this point? They don't sound good. We're really, really, really, really excited for it. We made this with all type of creators in mind, anything from professionals to content creators to teachers to educators to anybody. And the sensor is something we're really excited about. But, with all our products, is the special sauce, and the special sauce is always our software. So, our software is probably one of the most customizable, so many options, you can do ISO, you could do picture exposure, you could white balance-

Larry Hryb: Here's a shot of it right here, actually.

Miguel Lozada: Yep. Right. So, zooming, theater view, contrast saturation, exposure. Right there, you see the ISO. It's an active response, giving you the actual ISO live, versus just taking a few seconds to analyze it. So, as you brighten yourself, dim yourself, you're going to see that value change. Shutter speed, compensation, everything. We tried to give you guys as much control as possible. And, the button you see right there that says save? You can save the settings to the camera directly, which I believe is a first. So, you can save it, and you can take it somewhere, and it'll have all your settings saved.

Larry Hryb: That's pretty amazing. And you can see it's USBC in the back here. That's pretty cool, Miguel, because you tweak it and dial it, and then what I love about it is, I love it set up, I'm using it right now, and I kind of pushed it through there, and then when I change... I have a different computer, a different Windows 10 computer, like when I'm doing my Teams calls, just all the settings are just right there, and I don't have to worry about re... what's going on here, and my field of view, and all that stuff. But a lot of those features that you talked about on the software, those are really cool, because it's kind of like a DSLR, right? In fact, I think this is the Windows version. We were showing the Mac version a moment ago, because it's available on both platforms.

Miguel Lozada: Yep. So, both platforms. Yes, kind of sort of inspired by DSLR. So, we want to give you guys as much control. This is the basics. And, will we see new upgrades? Probably, software-wise, that's something Elgato is known for is our post-product support for all of our products. Stream Deck is probably one of the most upgrades products I've ever seen. You're always getting updates, plug-ins, integrations with new products, everything like that. So, that's kind of sort of what we hang our chip on, I guess.

Larry Hryb: When you look at the face cam, and again, you guys were kind enough to send me one, so I'm using it here, the picture quality, it's really that beautiful glass and this massive sensor that you have in the back there to give it this really crisp image. And it's 1080p60. It's stunning.

Miguel Lozada: 1080p60, eight lenses. We dedicated a lot of time, the team of engineers, they worked tirelessly. You guys have no idea. We're really, really, really lucky to have everybody that worked on this. We wanted something great for you guys, as creators, as broadcasters, as educators, whatever the case may be, and finally, we were able to present something and give you guys something of that quality.

Larry Hryb: So, that's kind of cool. And when will that be available, and how do they grab one? And what's the price?

Miguel Lozada: It's available now. $199.99. You can go to Elgato.com and check it out, for your region. If you're in different regions, it will be different pricing, and different retailers, and how you can get it. But, Elgato.com, and available now.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. So, that's one thing. Now, we talked about the fact that it doesn't have a microphone onboard, because let's be clear, if you're doing a good stream or you're doing Zoom or Teams calls all day, you don't want to have that microphone way back in the... You'll just shut it off anyway, and it's just nonsense. When you're going to choose your sound, you know you don't choose it anyway. So, you have this great Wave microphone line. You've got the Wave 1 and the Wave 3. I'm using the Wave 3 here. And as an audio nerd, I'm really excited about this next thing. Tell us about this next Wave product that you guys have.

Miguel Lozada: So, we have three, but I think you're talking about the XLR.

Larry Hryb: Yeah.

Miguel Lozada: Right here is our audio interface, really. A lot of fans loved the Wave Link software when they saw it, but they were already committed or already purchased XLR. So, we wanted to bring a way for XLR users to use Wave Link. So, Wave Link XLR. Pretty cool things about this product, the knob console works the same way the knob does on the Wave 3. You can change, you press, it changes what you're changing, between headphones, game, and PC mic mix. But, another cool thing is the face plate's actually customizable, so is the knob. So, we did that within mine. It also should power all mics out there. We've tested a lot of mics. You shouldn't need Phantom power. You shouldn't need anything like that. It should have enough oomph for it. And right there in the back, you see the captive mute, that everybody loves on the Wave 3. It's here. It'll be on the Wave XLR. So, if you press it, it'll mute your Wave XLR immediately without any sounds or buttons or anything needed.

Larry Hryb: And I've got to tell you, I'm so excited about this, because I know that I'm not the normal person, because I collect microphones, and all my microphones are XLR, which for those of you who don't know, it's... Let me get my microphone... Ah, it's over there. It's the standard for most non-USB microphones, let's be clear. So, the fact that I can have some of my high-end microphones... and you can see it in the back there. I can just plug it in, and obviously I'll plug my headphones in, and get access to this huge dial. The other part of it, and you talked about the face cam with the software. The Wave software is very cool, because you have a lot of things you can do in there with the low pass filters and things like that. So, there's some secret sauce in your software as well that you can use with your new microphone, or with your new mixer.

Miguel Lozada: Clip Guard being one of the most important ones, I think, for a lot of people. Clipping is a big audio issue, so buying this gives you access to Wave Link, which also gives you access to Clip Guard. And then, the channels. You can have a music channel. You can have a systems channel. You can have different channels. You can control what you hear and what your audience hears, balance too, immediately, and it changes on the fly. One of the coolest audio products that we've come out with, software-wise, obviously, and our first, but we were really happy with it, and again, you'll probably see some upgrades too as the future unfolds for Wave.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. One of the neat features that you upgraded, just for the Wave software for the current Wave microphones, is the fact that you can lock the settings so that your software doesn't overwrite it elsewhere. And I noticed in the latest update, I got that, and I was like, that's great, because you never know. You're like, "Oh, I set this thing," and then who knows, mysteriously something decides to change it, and you never go back and look at it, because why would you go back and look at it? Because you set it already. But you go back and it's changed.

Miguel Lozada: Yeah. So, a lot of programs have their own gain or what they want your mic to be at, or they have their own auto-detect, so it messes around with it a lot. So, we decided, okay, we can't control everybody else, but we can control what the program does. We can control what they control on our hardware, on our end.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. Wave XLR. And when's that going to be available, and what's the price point on that?

Miguel Lozada: Available now, $149.99.

Larry Hryb: All right. Now, next up, you've got your microphone, I've got my great XLR mic. What am I going to do? I need something to put it on. I've got mine on this old mic stand here, but you guys have announced not one but two microphone arms, right? Let's talk about those. It sounds like, oh, that's boring, but yeah, this is a critical part of your kit.

Miguel Lozada: This is actually the most exciting for me personally. My gripe has always been... This is a high end one. We added this nice little pole that you see here that makes it available to go over your monitor. So, that's how I have mine set up. I use it for like a camera, actually use it for like a camera arm for unboxings. But it goes over my monitor easier with that pole. This one also comes with a weight, so if your mic or whatever you're using is too light, it needs more weight, we have a weight changer right there. And, 360 movement with the ball mount. Really, really, really clean cord management. That's something we want to bring to everybody, is super clean cord management. Yeah. So, this one would be $9.99. So would the next one we're probably going to see here shortly. But, both mic arms, this one, this is my favorite. This is my personal favorite, because I've always wanted an affordable, low profile mic arm.

Larry Hryb: Right.

Miguel Lozada: And this is it. This is it. This is a low profile mic arm. I actually have mine coming in from behind my monitor, because my monitor is high enough to clear it. And, yeah, I love this thing. This thing has made my life so much easier. I can type underneath it. Like you, you have your arm coming out right here. I've always, always... or even the high end, the high ones that come like this. And me personally, I've always not liked that. I'm just like, why, why, why? And, yeah, this low one, I think, just takes the tension away from anything else, and puts you in focus, gives you your mic front and center as well, in a way where it doesn't really take away from you or your content. And, we're super excited about that one.

Larry Hryb: And you can swing it out of the way. The other thing I really like, and I want to just take a look at this shot again, for those of you that have been around Elgato and Elgato fans for a while, something very subtle here. And this is the fact that it's the same connection on all your other parts. So, I've got this arm here that I use for my lighting. I took it down. That's why I'm different lit today. But I wanted to show that it's this little device right here, which is so universal and so great because you can put it on any angle. You guys brought that right over to your new set of arms. So, you can, as you said, use the arm for a microphone, for a camera. It's expendable. You can use it for a light. There's all sorts of things you could use it for, right?

Miguel Lozada: Yeah. So, we want to make everything work together, friendly. If you wanted to put a key light on the low profile mic arm for some reason, yeah, you could. Sure. Maybe for photography, having a light so close to a product, or something with a tiered shot. But, it's all a big system. We want everybody... If you buy into Elgato, it's all going to work together. You're not going to have to buy a new connector or worry about this or that. It's all going to work the same, and you're going to be familiar with it, too. So, user experience as well, so that's very important to us, too.

Larry Hryb: All right. The final product that we're going to talk about today is... It's kind of interesting. It's a Stream Deck, but it's a little bit different. So, tell us what's different about this Stream Deck. So, we've seen Stream Decks for years.

Miguel Lozada: Stream Deck, man, 2017, time has flown. This thing has seen so many software upgrades. So, we thought, hey, maybe it's time to give the actual hardware a little bit of an upgrade. It's still the Stream Deck you love and know, just some quality of life stuff. The dock is the same dock that now the XLR has had, so it's not the little dock base that we did before. And, then as well as the connector. But there's also just a little bit of Elgato-ness in it. So, the face plates come off. What does that mean? You can customize your face plates. So, not only now can you customize the icons, you can customize the face plates. You can express yourself. You can do a full-themed setup.
For the industry, for gaming, obviously kits with Halo or Gears of War themed, that's now easily done. We were able to do those before. It took a little bit more manufacturing and more hard work, but now we brought it to everybody, and hopefully the plan is in the future, people will be able to make their own, but right now, we just have a whole bunch of static custom ones that people can make.

Larry Hryb: Awesome. Well, listen, this has been... It's always great to chat with you, but it's so good to see you and some of the great stuff that you and the team at Elgato is doing. It's just great stuff. And if you're just starting out and you're streaming or you're doing some content creation, this is the stuff that you really need to look at, because you're like, "Well, I want to upgrade my mic experience, I want to upgrade my lighting or my live switching experience," or now, your camera. That's some great stuff there. So, Miguel, I want to thank you for your time. I know people can find you on social. I'll throw your handle up here underneath here. How do they find you? Just shout it out for those people that are listening, just the audio version.

Miguel Lozada: Twitter, Twitter, Twitter, @mlozada.com, M-L-O-Z-A-D-A. I'm a big Twitter guy, so you can always reach me there, ask me questions, always available. But thank you, Larry, for having me on. We're super excited. Glad to have the products in your hands, too, and get your feedback, and looking forward to everybody else's feedback as well.

Rebecca Gordius: All right, thank you to our interview guests this week. Since Jeff is off busy being a new uncle, I will take us through the headlines.

Larry Hryb: All right, and I'll join you as well.

Rebecca Gordius: Pumba just woke up.

Larry Hryb: Pumba just woke up because, he's like, "Jeff's gone? I can do this." We've got a couple of news things before we wrap up the show. We wanted to make sure... It's not all the Xbox news, but these are some of the big things that everyone was talking about this week. So, what have you got there, Rebecca?

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. So, first, not really news, but something kind of interesting. We released a music video to celebrate Xbox All Access, to All 4 One's I Swear.

Larry Hryb: (singing) Well, it's funny-

Rebecca Gordius: Exactly.

Larry Hryb: ... when we released this, I've talked about this, I don't know if I shared this on social, but Rebecca, I used to work in radio, and I was working in radio when this song came-

Rebecca Gordius: You have the right voice for it.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. Well, thank you. I worked in radio when this song came out in 1994, so I remember... I don't remember what record company it was, but they came... So, I promoted this record, and I think I did a show with them at this place called Lake Compounds up in Connecticut, in Bristol. And it was so funny, when the team released this thing... because you've got to go watch. Go to news.xbox.com, because it's the actual band. It's All 4 One doing a revision of I Swear to some... It's all there, for Xbox All Access. Do you remember the song?

Rebecca Gordius: I actually do remember the song. I am not that young. I remember the song. I can't sing it aside from... (singing)

Larry Hryb: I swear. If we had Jeff here, we'd be able to harmonize, because he's got such a great voice. But yeah-

Rebecca Gordius: Maybe next time.

Larry Hryb: There's something about a good, smooth R&B lick, and that's what this is, so I'm really... Go check the video out when you can. So, that came out while we were away. What else have you got there?

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. And then, like I mentioned, Echoing Void... Gosh, now I'm going to catch myself saying, "Um," since Jeff pointed out the um thing. We announced Echoing Void, which is the sixth and final DLC for now for Minecraft Dungeons coming July 28th. We also are going to be releasing an ultimate edition for the game, so if you're kind of new to Minecraft Dungeons, or if you just want the base game, you want to catch up on all the different DLCs, you can get the ultimate edition, and it's kind of the all-inclusive. It is all there, the package.

Larry Hryb: (singing)

Rebecca Gordius: And then every time we release a DLC for Minecraft Dungeons, we also release a free game update, too, so this one is called the Gauntlet of Gales, and it's a maze. I've heard it's very confusing, but it looks like fun. So, you'll have to check that out July 28th, so a couple more weeks.
And there's also some new settings to the Xbox Family Settings app, which I didn't know a lot about, but it's actually really cool, and this is something that I'm going to keep in my back pocket as someone who works at Minecraft. There are a lot of different settings that I think if parents knew that they had the option to, it would make them feel a lot more comfortable about their kids playing online. There's the option to approve multiplayer access, which we released just a couple of months ago. But, for the new settings we're introducing, there is the ability to add money to someone's account. So, if your kid got straight As, you can give them $20 to spend through the Family Settings app. And there's also-

Larry Hryb: But only if they got straight As. But only if they got straight As.

Rebecca Gordius: Only. Yes. I know. I think I got $20 per A, which was actually pretty good.

Larry Hryb: Wow. Now, question.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: Was it $20 for A? Did you get $15 for a B, or was it $20 or nothing?

Rebecca Gordius: It was $20 or nothing.

Larry Hryb: I appreciate that.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: Okay.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. But also in the Family Settings app, you can see their spending history, which is pretty cool.

Larry Hryb: Very cool.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. So, there's a lot of good stuff to check out there. And then also this week, MLB The Show 21, having the all star content extravaganza.

Larry Hryb: I forgot about that. That's right.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. I'm not a big baseball person, but I think there's a lot in there to check out.

Larry Hryb: Wait, if you're in New York, you need to go to a Yankees game or a Mets game. You've got to do that for me.

Rebecca Gordius: I've been told that I'm supposed to cheer for the Mets and not the Yankees.

Larry Hryb: Well, I'm not going to say that you should or shouldn't. You decide what you want to do. What I'm saying, you should at least experience both of those fabulous parks.

Rebecca Gordius: Right. I would love to. I do kind of want to root for the Yankees. I don't know. I remain undecided about which baseball team I'll go for.

Larry Hryb: Don't torch her in the YouTube comments, please. Go ahead.

Rebecca Gordius: Oh, yeah. Maybe that was a mistake. And then, Jeff met with the team from Codemasters, but F1: 2021 released this week, so if you want to check it out, we have a bunch of tips on Xbox Wire for making the most out of your digital driving experience.

Larry Hryb: Yes.

Rebecca Gordius: And then, a couple of more things. Civilization 6: The Anthology, whole bundle, which has all the previously released content.

Larry Hryb: Are you a Civ fan?

Rebecca Gordius: I'm not.

Larry Hryb: Okay. That's fine.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: I know there's a lot of people that are, and I know E used to be on the show, he still plays Civ to this day. He's still going at it. So, it's such a great game.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. No, I understand the value. It's just, I don't know, there's something about it that makes me think that it's a lot of time sink, but then I guess I also played the crap out of Skyrim, so I don't know if I have room to talk there.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, you can say that about any game, Rebecca.

Rebecca Gordius: I know.

Larry Hryb: You can say that about any game, or any hobby, to be honest with you.

Rebecca Gordius: Yep. And then, last, we have UFC 4 arriving on EA Play, which is included for all Xbox-

Larry Hryb: Game Pass Ultimate.

Rebecca Gordius: ... Game Pass Ultimate members.

Larry Hryb: Yeah.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: Fun.

Rebecca Gordius: So, go into UFC 4, break a leg, or if you're Conor McGregor, try not to break your other one.

Larry Hryb: Exactly. Be careful. I didn't realize you were a UFC fan.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah, but those are the headlines for the week.

Larry Hryb: I didn't realize you were a UFC fan.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. I mostly go to the parties for the unhealthy snacks and... But no, I like UFC. I like fighting. Yeah, it's all good. I like any sports. So, yeah.

Larry Hryb: Are you going to go out to the US Open out in Flushing in August, late August, early September? Tennis.

Rebecca Gordius: Oh. Probably not. I take it back. I guess not all sports are my thing.

Larry Hryb: Please don't torch her in the comments, all you tennis fans watching.

Rebecca Gordius: Sorry, sorry. I know. No, I like playing tennis. Just, I haven't been able to get into watching it.

Larry Hryb: As a spectator.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah, but then the opposite with fighting. I like watching fighting, but I'm content to just watch.

Larry Hryb: Well, at the very least, I need you to go to a New York baseball game and enjoy that.

Rebecca Gordius: Yes.

Larry Hryb: Because you've been-

Rebecca Gordius: I think that's-

Larry Hryb: You've been to a Mariners game out here in Seattle, right?

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah. That's on the to-do list.

Larry Hryb: Yeah, I think you've been to Mariners game, right?

Rebecca Gordius: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Larry Hryb: Yeah. So, it's a lovely experience.

Rebecca Gordius: Yeah.

Larry Hryb: Anyway, so thank you for covering the news since Jeff is off being a new uncle. Congratulations to Jeff. So, that's always fun to do. So, it's-

Rebecca Gordius: Congrats to Jeff's family.

Larry Hryb: Yeah. Congrats to Jeff's family. I don't know... I'll find out who had the little one, but congratulations to him. Anyway, well, we're going to wrap it up, because we've got a bunch of long interviews for you to enjoy, and now that we're just down to Rebecca and I, we don't want to keep staring at each other. And you've got work to do. I've got work to do. You've got to get back to the-

Rebecca Gordius: I need to take this dog out for a walk. Yep.

Larry Hryb: You need to take the dog out, and I always respect the dog. Well, you'll join us next week. We'll be back in force all next week. Hopefully. This summer's a little crazy with schedules and getting outside and taking dogs for walks. So, thank you for joining us. Remember, if you like and subscribe and do all that stuff at YouTube, drop a note in the comments. Don't torch. Don't torch Rebecca, please. But, you can follow me on Twitter @MajorNelson, and Rebecca's one of the 10 people I follow, so you can just go find her as well. Are you getting a lot of noise in your Twitter stream from me following you?

Rebecca Gordius: It's not too bad. I need to use Twitter more often. I'm more of a lurker than a tweeter myself, but it's all good.

Larry Hryb: Right, right. That's fair. All right. Well, we'll see you guys next week. Rebecca, thanks. Stay cool, or stay dry out there, I should say, and we'll see you guys next time. Bye-bye everybody.

Rebecca Gordius: Thanks. Bye.